Dialogue with Rob Bell

Rob Bell is the teaching pastor at Mars Hill in Grandville, Michigan, and the author of two books, Velvet Elvis: Repainting the Christian Faith and Sex God, both published by Zondervan, as well as the featured presenter on the NOOMA (phonetic Greek for spirit or breath) DVD’s, a series of short films on spiritual direction that have sold 1.1 million copies in more than thirty countries. His teachings at Mars Hill are downloaded by more than 56,000 people weekly.

Mars Hill is no more your average church than Rob is your average pastor. Fueled by the need for an alternative to the usual sermon and worship service, Rob founded Mars Hill in an old shopping mall on the fringes of Grand Rapids. Nine years later, it has grown into a megachurch, boasting a weekly attendance of more than 11,000.

I sat down with Rob in the auditorium of the Somerville Theater, just outside of Boston, on the eighteenth day of The God’s Aren’t Angry tour, his second such campaign in the last two years.

(Editor’s Note: Robert Havey’s questions will appear in bold, followed by Rob Bell’s responses.)

Robert Havey: Twenty two cities in twenty two consecutive nights. How are you holding up?

Rob Bell: Great!

Yeah?

Oh yeah! I love this.

What time did you get in? Did you get in today or last night?

Um, well you sleep on the bus all night so you wake up in the parking lot behind the venue each morning. I think this morning was nine, maybe eight - usually first thing in the morning. The driver drives all night, so you wake up…

Oh, it’s a bus? I was thinking you were flying around.

Now that would be killer.

Yeah, that would be killer.

I know you’ve been interviewed to death, and I’ve read all of them. It’s the same old questions. I don’t know if I’m going to be asking the same old questions but one of the things that I’ve noticed - and my observation could be wrong - and I know what your answer to this was about your demographics - it was sinners - and I understand that, but what’s the demographic of your sinners? It seems to me it’s a twenties, thirties majority. Is that wrong or…

Interesting. I don’t know.

Haven’t noticed?

I mean there are lots of people in their sixties and seventies who are fully engaged so - that’s a good question. I don’t know. Seems to me like there’s just one of everything. One of everybody. Demographic sinners. Man, that sounds like something I would have said.

Well, I was introduced to you by someone who said, “You’ve got to read Velvet Elvis”, so I read it - loved it! It spoke to me and I’m fifty nine, so I guess demographics don’t really matter. God’s people are God’s people. The God’s Aren’t Angry - interesting title. What does it mean?

Are you coming tonight?

Absolutely - wouldn’t miss it.

Gosh I can’t give it away. I’m just taking people on a journey through where humans even got the idea of religion. Where did people even cook up the idea that there are these forces that are invisible but you’re somehow dependent upon? Then from there, where did the idea of an altar or sacrifice come about? Why did people begin to name these deities and where did the idea come about that there are these forces that you can’t control - that you are at the mercy of that need to be kept appeased or kept happy or kept on your side.

Essentially it’s kind of anthropology of religion. Where did the first people even come up with all this stuff? So that’s kind of the journey that people will go on tonight.

Okay. I know you said that men invented religion to make themselves feel better.

That’s one of the things I trace is where did the impulse arise in human history that there are these forces that need to be kept happy or things won’t go well for you. You can find this in every culture almost. Here are the three things - here are the seven steps - here are the requirements and if you just would do this, then - then it’ll go well for you.

So that’s part of the things that I’ve been exploring and part of what this tour’s about.

So what you’re really talking about, I think, is performance based spirituality? You have to do this to get this or if you don’t do this, this will happen to you?

Well, that’s generally been how religion has evolved over the years. It’s generally had, at it’s core, some sense of somebody, somewhere is upset, or going to be upset, or could be offended unless you do - and then everybody fills in the blank. So there’s a certain primal anxiety that has arisen over the years, and you can find this in the earliest cradles of civilization - that you must keep these forces on your side or your gonna be in trouble and here’s how you do it, and for me it raises all sorts of fascinating connections with the world that we live in today, which is kind of what we explore.

I met a guy recently who asked me what the name of the tour was and I said, “The Gods Aren’t Angry”, and he said, “Well they are with me,” and I just found that fascinating.

It’s one of the questions I’m asking on the tour - this talk you’re going to hear. Do we have the same old primal deities - we just call them by different names? And are these same old forces still at work - are people still bowing down to the same forces? We just are so convinced of our evolution and our progress and our innovation that it’s hard to admit it. I’ve loved the reaction I’ve been getting - it’s been great.